I fact checked climate claims in Donald Trump's appearance on the Joe Rogan podcast
Former President Donald Trump gave one of his longest interviews in episode #2219 of the Joe Rogan Experience podcast in the days leading up to the 2024 US Presidential Election.
The conversation meandered through a range of topics, that Donald (Don? I’m going to use Don to save my character count) acknowledged as part of his signature: “My speeches last a long time because of the weave, you know, I mean, I weave stories into it.”
Some of those weaves touched on the environment, energy and food: Oil was mentioned 12 times, and topics like electric cars, natural gas, nuclear energy, wildfires, and garbage were all dubbed weave-worthy.
The first episode I ever heard of the Joe Rogan Experience was episode #1761 with Jim Gaffigan during a road trip with a friend. What struck me was that listening to Joe is like hanging out with my friends. We go to the gym or the coffee shop or potlucks and talk about all sorts of topics. We share stories, anecdotes, and experiences from our lives or those we know.
“My dad used to work in this industry, and one time he had to do this project…”
“I sat next to someone on a plane once who had this experience…”
That’s how we have conversations. And conversations aren’t journalism. Conversations aren’t quantitative scientific research, rather they are qualitative, and the casual listener likely hasn’t had the pleasure of taking Dr. Judith Weiner’s (very difficult) research methods class to know the difference.
I love my friends, but I don’t presume our conversations to be factually accurate all of the time. Our conversations also aren’t broadcast to millions of listeners that might use that information to make important decisions. The stakes are different.
HOW TO READ THIS
Conversations aren’t black and white, and this one is particularly wide and weaving. Don and Joe said as much in the episode. So to bring some order, here’s how to read this review:
Rating: This 3-point scale ranks claims as 🔴 red (mostly false), 🟢 green (mostly true) and 🟡 yellow for the more nuanced, it depends, double negatives.
Timestamps: I’ve included timestamps where the topics are discussed and encourage you to listen for yourself. The bulk of the environmental conversation takes place between 46:31 and 1:14:19 on the YouTube post.
Topic: The statement being reviewed for accuracy derived from direct statements from Joe or Don, a summary of the conclusions drawn on that topic, or questions that Joe asks directly that Don affirms. This is not exhaustive by any means. Remember, weaves.
Findings: This is a succinct summary of the facts, which, while giving respect to some nuance, are written to be clear and readable. Links to sources are included so you can dig deeper.
THE TOPICS
🔴 41:36 The Biden administration spent $9 billion to build eight electric vehicle charging stations.
Don has made similar comments at rallies, though the dollar amount and number of chargers changes between appearances.
It’s presumed he is referring to the $7.5 billion allocation from the Inflation Reduction Act to build 500,000 EV charging stations. The program was announced in February 2023 and funds have been slow to deploy as states secure contractor bids. Anyone can visit invest.gov to see $3.2 billion in projects that have been tentatively awarded so far. Since the start of the Biden-Harris Administration, the number of publicly available EV chargers has doubled. Link, Link, Link, Link, Link
🔴 51:37 The asset value of the US oil reserves is enough to pay off the $35 trillion national debt.
BP estimates the US has 68.8 billion barrels in reserve. At a price of $70 per barrel of oil, that’s $4.816 trillion. When oil is drilled, 12-25% is paid to mineral royalty owners and the rest goes to operators as profits and to cover expenses. It’s unclear how these funds could be directed to the national debt.
🟡 52:20 Environmental consultants profit from dragging out environmental impact study processes.
Businesses should aim to be profitable when providing services. However, these roles are not highly paid. The median annual salaries for environmental scientists, specialists and consultants are around $79,000. Link, Link
🔴 56:50 During the Trump presidency, the United States had the cleanest air and cleanest water.
AIR: During his presidency, Don issued an executive order that led to the repeal of the Clean Power Plan, which regulated power plant emissions. Other requirements that limit emissions from oil and gas drilling, new vehicles and mercury and air toxic standards were also rolled back. Link, Link
WATER: The 1972 Clean Water Act was largely repealed during the Trump presidency. Link, Link, Link
🟢 57:38 Garbage can float from China to California and the US is cleaning it up.
Most trash coming from the east ends up in the Great Pacific Garbage Patch (GPGP), located between California and Hawaii. The GPGP is twice the size of Texas and is the world’s largest ocean waste repository. It includes trash from China, the United States and other countries sharing the Pacific Ocean since ocean currents carry trash from many directions. A San Francisco-based nonprofit The Ocean Cleanup is on a 10-year mission to clean up the GPGP. Link, Link, Link, Link, Link
🟢 57:40 California water supplies drain to the Pacific Ocean.
The Sacramento-San Joaquin River Delta supplies water for over 27 million Californians and supports the state’s enormous agricultural industry. Delicate species in the delta are threated by increasing salinity and warming waters. During a heavy wet season from 2022 to 2023, 95% of the rainwater flowed to the Pacific Ocean. While reservoirs filled during that period, groundwater recharge and rainwater harvesting programs lag in maturity. Link, Link, Link, Link
🔴 59:49 The water supply for Los Angeles is restricted from flowing from Canada.
Los Angeles’ water supply does not flow from Canada. Los Angeles’ water primarily comes from the Colorado River.
The Sacramento-San Joaquin River Delta also does not flow from Canada.
Don has proposed using routing water from the Columbia River in British Columbia to California. The river drains to Oregon and into the Pacific Ocean. The US cannot solely dictate the water flow without Canadian cooperation. Link, Link, Link, Link
🔴 1:04:30 California is not allowed to rake forests for wildfire prevention.
Fuel reduction is the process of removing or reducing the amount of flammable vegetation to reduce the risk of wildfires. California can and does rake forests as part of its Vegetation Management Program (VMP) and other fuel reduction projects like prescribed burns. The state allocated new project funding in 2023, but is behind the joint California and federal target of 1 million acres treated per year. Link, Link, Link, Link, Link, Link, Link
🟢 1:06:00 California restricted power use due to instability in its grid.
During the summer of 2022, Californians suffered rolling blackouts due to an overtaxed energy grid. Similar issues occurred in 2001 after energy deregulation. Link, Link, Link
🟢1:06:27 Nuclear is the cleanest, safest form of electricity that we could generate.
Nuclear power produces no greenhouse gas emissions and is the second largest source of zero emission energy in the US and can run 24/7. Facilities are expensive to build and maintain, and public perception of safety remains a barrier to adoption. Link, Link
🔴 1:08:30 The US has more oil and gas than any other nation.
The US has the ninth most oil reserves based on 2021 prospecting data. Link, Link
🟢 1:08:40 Biden rescinded Trump-era drilling approval on the Arctic National Wildlife Refuge (ANWR).
Yes, the Biden-Harris Administration canceled oil and gas leases in a wildlife refuge. Link, Link
🔴 1:09:18 Drilling oil is not environmentally impactful because it’s deep underground.
Besides impacts on the surface where drilling occurs, waste fluids are flushed back into the earth after drilling creates risk of induced earthquakes, the name of earthquakes when they are the cause of human behavior. West Texas has seen record-breaking earthquakes in its drilling areas in 2023. Link, Link
🔴 1:10:06 You can bury wind turbine blades to safely get rid of it.
You cannot bury wind turbine blades to safely dispose of them. Innovation is in progress to recycle blades by shredding and reusing the fiberglass and plastic resin material to make a cement alternative. Recycling of these materials, while possible, is rare. Link, Link
🟢 1:11:00 Whale populations are disrupted by offshore windmills.
Whales use sound for navigation that can be disrupted by windmills. Link, Link